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Property taxes are already deductible when filing income taxes, as is interest on mortgages. The farmer is subsidized and receives state and federal aid already. They are a business like any other business. Make it work or do something else. This new bill would just be one more layer of helping those already receiving help.
Lower State spending, as in closing down facilities like that in Ogdensburg, and stop shifting the tax burden on to fewer and fewer people who do not fall under these special categories.

I knew what this article was really hinting at: conservatives vs. democrat.

First things first, GET SPENDING UNDER CONTROL ! Then work on taxation policy. In my town of Hermon, we have more equipment setting around collecting dust that was purchased for something that a rental piece of equipment would have done SO MUCH CHEAPER. Taxing the wealthy will just encourage the stupid spending habits of incompetent individuals overseeing your tax dollars ! I know, I have seen it first hand.

My Family has lived in the Northern NY for generations (both sides). I live here, work here, was a public official for 12 years. Does this mean I have "Seniority", or "privalage" over someone new to town ? Absolutely not. To think that I do would be, well...Stupid. It does not take a Genius to understand how young this country is, and how new we are to it (ask a Native American). We do not own the land (try missing 3 years on your property taxes and you will find out). Good people are "Good People", no matter where they are (same goes for the bad ones).

Sure I want to see new people move in it is a sign of growth. We need to be welcoming. New people need to be respectful of traditions that are already here though. They don't have to like them or do them, just don't tell me what I can and can't do in a place I grew up. Also it is true about the self confidence, I do complain sometimes but I choose to stay here because it is a great place for a variety of reasons.

The more new people the more people to support our school systems and roads and so forth we need you!

For those of us who have recently moved to upstate New York---you must know that we WANT to and LIKE living here - why else would we pay taxes out the wazoo?? We have found nothing but friendly people here in Dexter, NY....

It's dishonest when someone cuts and pastes an opinion from a conservative website without citing where they got the material or at least putting quotes around the material.

If Judicial Watch is so certain the self-executing rule is unconstitutional they have every right to bring suit. Bring it on while they still have a conservative SC.

But it is now a moot point since the House has decided not to use the self-executing rule.

I'm fairly new, but one thing that astonished me is the lack of confidence of NCers in their own neck of the woods. You always get the question, "Why did you move HERE?"
They simply can't believe someone would choose to live here.
In a lot of cases, there's not the pride needed to really sell the place, IMO. If the North Country had the salesmanship of Vermont, or even of an armpit like Houston, the economy would be a lot better.
On the other hand, it probably stopped a real-estate bubble from forming.

In SL the last couple of weeks, one issue discussed extensively has been that of growth. How do we get new businesses to come to SL? How do we get good jobs for the residents of SL? How do we keep our children from leaving? It seems to me that for these things to happen, "outsiders" are going to have to move into the area. If it's a high tech business, it might even involve "elites" moving to the area. Read the welcoming comments to newcomers on the ADE website.

Dale I must rescind my "standing corrected". It seems "deem and pass" is only used when the text of both House and Senate Bill are exactly the same. That isn't the case here it seems. The House is required to vote on the Senate text!

" Let's set the record straight. What the dems are doing is totally unconstitutional and I'll explain why.

And, in the past, this "rule" was never used on something as big as a massive government take-over of our health care.

The Democratic leadership?s plan to use the ?Slaughter Rule? to pass the Senate health care bill without an explicit ?yea or nay? vote by the House is an absolute violation of the U.S. Constitution (Article 1, Section 7).

Indeed, the Supreme Court has held that ?(1) a bill containing its exact text was approved by a majority of the Members of the House of Representatives; (2) the Senate approved precisely the same text; and (3) that text was signed into law by the President. The Constitution explicitly requires that each of those three steps be taken before a bill may ?become a law.?? Clinton v. City of New York, 524 U.S. 417, 448 (1998)

Simply put, the House can?t pretend to vote on a bill and expect that the result will pass constitutional muster. No House member can keep true to his oath of office to ?support and defend the Constitution? and approve the use of the Slaughter Rule to avoid a direct vote on the Senate health care bill.

And the U.S. Constitution would also seem to require that President Obama veto any resulting ?bill? sent to him for signature, as the document that results from any House action under the Slaughter Rule is a constitutional nullity."

Looks like Tea Partiers know some other words, as well:
http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/2010/03/true_colors_even_worse_than_we_thought.php?ref=fpblg

10:33 and Bret4207 bring up an interesting point- does the State have an obligation to return our excess taxes paid? I really don't know. I Googled the question and found nothing concrete. It must be in a tax law somewhere?

(;03- Did you ever think maybe YOU are the reason re standoffish? Your post is pretty egotistical, as if the locals should be running to bask in your presence, and then you diss the locals for working for peanuts.

Nah, it must be them.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=122436097

Even NPR like Walker.

I really like this this guy, David Walker, former Comptroller General of the US. He resigned when the people in Gov't refused to listen to reason, that we were on the fast track to insolvency. A true whistle blower of the highest magnitude, and a patriot. Read what a guy who actually knows what Americas books look like says about health care. Then tell me it's all rhetoric.

http://www.rollcall.com/issues/55_74/guest/42137-1.html?type=printer_friendly

Here are more Shane, my confidence in Gov't is swelling....-

http://www.cato.org/pubs/tbb/tbb-0309-17.pdf

http://open.salon.com/blog/kenn_jacobine/2009/08/21/a_history_of_cost_overruns_should_squash_government_run_heal

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2009/nov/18/health-programs-have-history-of-cost-overruns/print/

http://www.downsizinggovernment.org/government-cost-overruns

I love this one, it follows my thinking, here's an excerpt-

"...As is, Obama?s plans will raise America?s debt level to 90% of GDP by 2020. If CBO is right, health-care reform should not alter that big number very much. But what if CBO is wrong? Not nearly as wrong as its predecessors in the 1960s, but say 20% wrong?

In that case, by the year 2019, the Obama plan will be costing Washington five times as much as the Afghanistan war is costing today ? and the U.S. will be headed toward a debt-GDP ratio closer to 100% than 90%...."

Nothing to worry about there!
http://network.nationalpost.com/NP/blogs/fullcomment/archive/2010/03/20/david-frum-a-nation-in-hock.aspx

Read these next two one after the other to get the full effect-

http://www.cato-at-liberty.org/2010/03/18/yet-another-fraudulent-cost-estimate/

http://www.cato-at-liberty.org/2010/03/18/lies-damned-lies-and-cbo-estimates/


That covers both Gov't in general and the CBO specifically. NObody is perfect, but when you're talking about this kind of money I'd like them to slow down a bit.

Do you want to depend on the Gov'ts forecast Shane? Okay, try this article-

http://stanford.wellsphere.com/healthcare-industry-policy-article/has-a-government-entitlement-program-ever-come-in-under-budget/850845

It supports your claim prescription drugs came in under budget, but I'm afraid that's about the only thing that did. But don't take my word for it, this is a doctor, try his opinion.

Does that count Amish and Mennonites and those who could have health care but refuse for what ever reason to partake of it? A raw number means-what? It's a number, it doesn't explain much of anything without more information.

I think there is some tension but in general it is not so bad. It does come down to respect. This is a rural environment, people rightfully enjoy hunting and fishing and also enjoy the outdoors using snowmobiles and atvs. There can be conflict in these areas but we should just respect each other and learn from each other.

Sometimes I get annoyed when people who move here ignore the very real issue of poverty that plagues our region, or pretend like it does not exist, there is definitely an elitist attitude among some people. You can see it in some of the disdainful attitudes people have about trying to keep the prison jobs and looking down on CO's and so forth or the attitudes about wind power or any new development. It is kind of like they don?t want real people actually living in their playground.

We also need to take into account the number of people in the North Country who have government insurance for the needy and the old; medicaid, medicare and Child Health Plus. How will this bill impact them?

mobillity itself is a sign of class difference. Locals watch their place degrade not as a direct result of the actions of newcomerers but as a result of the self actualizing ethic they embody. In a culture that monitizes everything personal weath trumps traditional values. Sadly Public radio does plenty to diminish the voice and the interests of locals.

I have lived in other places where I was the "newbie"...some incredibly welcoming where I formed life-long friends...some not so much. If I had not already known some folks here when I arrived 11 years ago, I would not have made it as I find it really difficult to get to know folks here...they just don't want to let a "newbie" in.
If and when you are allowed in, you couldn't wish for better friends and neighbors. Makes me think that folks are just so busy, they can't or don't make time for the 'newbie'.
Alas, not very many smiles given in shops or while strolling along Main St.

We all contribute to pay for the cost of care to the uninsured. Doctors and hospitals have to pay their bills so the cost of treating the uninsured gets added into the bills of the insured.

No, No and No. It is a lousy way. It cannot be done fairly. Go to any real estate site and see what people want for that property and land. It will only raise taxes on those who do not fall in to the "land rich " pocket poor group...

My family has owned land in the ADKs for 90 years, I went to highschool here, and have had several jobs over the past decade - but Im still an outsider - and thats okay. But it is the local's home, they have to open the door, whether or not we chose to call first, or knock first, at some point they have to act by opening up. There is a lot for us newcomers to learn from the locals and tons of good discussion to be had - which can be way more productive if done on a doorstep than at the voting polls.